After a couple of YFC meetings this morning I had lunch with a few people and Steve Croft from Fresh Expressions.
It was a great and interesting time as we chatted about how things could be sustained (drawing on experience in particular from Jonny (Grace), Ian (Moot) and Steve (Holy Joes.), what we think church is to us now, and other related questions.
I enjoyed hearing ideas from others which is helping me to process what will be happening in September. It was also encouraging, again, to be in an environment of people that understand the vagueness that there can be when looking at starting something new.
As time draws nearer for me I hear a number of questions along the lines of ‘what are you going to do?’ which I think kind of means ‘what is it going to look like?’ My answer of ‘I really don’t know!’ often draws a raised eyebrow or two.
It’s quite elemental for me to start without a blue print. I can’t see any other way of authentically finding a fresh expression with a group of people than seeking people and starting the process of exploration with them from scratch. Having ideas in my head, or a particular blueprint, stifles this process and I think all I would end up looking for would be people to help me achieve my dreams.
I think as an ordained pioneer minister my role should be quite a lot about working with searching people and journeying together to see our dreams become a reality. Authentic community, faithful ownership, and honest planning can only occur when we generally not only want the ideas and dreams of others but are willing to walk into them with others as well.
The Shiny Headed Prophet 
Is “Youth for Christ” the same organization as the one Billy Graham and Charles Templeton once represented in Europe in the 1940s or 50s? (Have you read the story of what happened to Chuck or Charles Templeton?) At any rate, I wanted to say I was cruising the web and ran across your paper on Church History (with which I agree) and also your paper on the Kingdom of God (with which I disagree). Please see Edward Adams’s timely rebuttal to N.T. Wright’s attempts to ignore the “near end times” beliefs of New Testament Christians: Stars Will Fall from Heaven: Cosmic Catastrophe in the New Testament and Its World (Library of New Testament Studies) by Edward Adams http://www.amazon.com/Stars-Will-Fall-Heaven-Catastrophe/dp/0567089126/ref=wl_it_dp?ie=UTF8&coliid=I3AYCYSRWO295N&colid=1Z88CWX9UENVE Adams’s book is amazing (and also unfortunately amazingly expensive, perhaps borrow from interlibrary loan and peruse it a bit) I’ve also had some discussions with the author and he liked my online piece, “The Lowdown on God’s Showdown”http://secweb.infidels.org/?kiosk=articles&id=86Cheers,Ed( Edward T. Babinski, author of Leaving the Fold )
Again, on the topic of “The Kingdom of God” and “end times,” and “Daniel.” I’ve spoken with scholars such as J.J. Collins, one of the world’s foremost experts on intertestamental literature, and he agrees that there is no “prophecy” in Daniel that unequivocally “predicted” the “fall of Jerusalem” a certain number of years later. In fact he doubts that the ancients knew exactly what century they were living and were simply citing Daniel in retrospect like in the case of many other O.T. verses made use of by N.T. authors. Other intertestamental authors had even begun citing “Daniel” even before Christianity like the authors of the Dead Sea Scrolls. And certainly Daniel itself was a book that appeared late compared with other O.T. works, hence its self-depiction of having been “sealed up” until “the end of time.” It’s sudden late arrival on the scene was presumably due to its having been “sealed” for such a long time. Convenient, no? It suddently appears around the time of the Maccabean revolt against a Greek ruler of Jerusalem who had defiled the Temple. See also these books (both by Christians):Prophecy and Prediction by Dewey M. Beegle (ex-inerrantist, Bible scholar and translator) andIn God’s Time by Craig Hill http://www.ingodstime.com/
Edwardthanks for your comments and for your pointer to your article.For my essay I did a fair bit of research and currently I still put my lot in with NT Wright and the destruction of the temple on this one – but the beauty of theology is that it is often possible to see both sides of a view – in that frame its important that we all keep talking and discussing!I hope your web cruising continues to go well.And yes … it is the same YFC that Dr Billy set up in the UK … and still going strong!